Discussion:
Hypocrisy
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Nate
2004-02-07 09:16:28 UTC
Permalink
I really do believe that the person who is without sin should be casting the
first stone. The trouble is that if you take that point of view and the
other side casts stones at you all day long, unless you're willing to break
that rule and point out that when they throw a stone they're being
hypocritical because they are as guilty as anyone else of sinning, you've
effectively allowed them to "win" the argument. And that's also wrong.
They also say people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.



Well, I'm not without sin and I live in a glass house, but I can't stand
hypocrisy. And when we look at the Bush administration and the Bush family
values, it's an interesting contrast to the view of these so-called
ministers. Prescott Bush, for example, who was George Bush's grandfather
and a Senator, paid a large fine during World War II for continuing to do
business with Nazi Germany after American boys were over there dying
fighting the Nazis. In other words, it could certainly be argued that his
behavior was traitorous. He was helping them get the fuel they needed to
fuel the Nazi war machine. And by extension, to feed the gas chambers.



George W. Bush himself - and again, I don't want to spend a whole lot of
time talking about this and frankly, to me, it's not very important. Except
that people need to understand how hypocritical these people are. The Bush
campaign for example, has admitted that Bush was arrested for two felonies
in his life. I wonder how many people out there themselves have been
arrested twice for felonies. Not many, I don't think.



Dick Cheney was arrested twice for drunk driving - that's a felony. That's
four felonies for the people that are in charge here. But it's not just
that. There's pretty good evidence that Bush was arrested for cocaine use
in Houston. He gave a non-denial denial when he was asked about it. If you
want to talk about his family values, a reporter in 1988 asked George W.
Bush what he and his father talked about in their private moments. Bush
responded with a word that relates to part of a woman's anatomy that begins
with a "P." Nobody in my family has ever used a word like that. And I don'
t think it expresses particularly good values to hear it come from the man
who was eventually elected - well actually selected - President.



What was he doing in the month before 9/11 when maybe he should have been
looking at terrorism? Well, after five months in office he took a
thirty-day vacation. In my family, values mean that you give a day's work
for a day's pay. A month vacation after five months work? That's pretty
extreme.



Jeb Bush's 24-year-old daughter Noelle was undergoing treatment for drug
abuse. She got that treatment after being arrested. Many people would have
been sent to prison. She was caught in the drug treatment plant with
drugs . and they sentenced her to more treatment. And then she was caught a
second time in the drug treatment program with drugs and again they gave her
treatment. Now, frankly I agree with that. I think that most nonviolent
drug offenders really ought to be given treatment, certainly it would be a
lot cheaper. Why spend $25,000 a year to keep somebody in prison when you
can put them through a rehab program and maybe save their lives for $14,000?



It's a good thing that had happened to Noelle Bush. But when the Bushes are
calling for increased penalties for everyone else and finding a way to send
their own children into rehab, that's what I call wing-nut hypocrisy.



And it's not just Noelle. It's George W. Bush's daughters, Jenna and
Barbara. One of them has two criminal convictions for alcohol possession
and alcohol use by a minor and the other has one. Again, I wonder how many
people out there have two children who have been arrested three times for
alcohol abuse. It seems to me that that's indicative of a larger family
problem.



Bush's father for example, pardoned a Pakistani heroin smuggler who donated
a great deal of money to his campaign just as he was leaving office. They
didn't have any trouble criticizing Bill Clinton for doing something
similar. And I'm not arguing whether it was good or bad, I'm just saying
that to talk about one and ignore the other seems to me to be a little bit
of a problem.



And the third son, the one that nobody talks about very much, Neil Bush.
Well, he was the head of a bank in Colorado that ended up costing taxpayers
millions and millions of dollars because of bank fraud. And in his divorce,
he admitted to having gone to Thailand and in his own words, he thinks he
might have had sex with women, not his wife, two or three times which of
course leaves the question of why he can't remember sitting there for the
rest of us to wonder. But that's just the Bush family. When we talk about
right wing hypocrisy on this topic, there's a lot more involved than just
the Bush family.



Dick Armey of Texas; several of his students have come forward and said that
he was regularly engaged in inappropriate behavior for them and in fact his
second wife was one of his students. Bob Barr of Georgia, arbiter of family
values, he's on his third marriage, and there are photographs around of him
in a strip club engaged in an activity with a stripper that would be more
embarrassing than I'm willing to relate right here.



Gary Bauer, one of the absolute centerpieces of the family values movement
found almost his entire staff resigned because of his relationship with a
26-year-old deputy campaign manager that he traveled with for months at a
time.



Bill Bennet; he is literally the man when it comes to virtue on the radical
right. He wrote The Book of Virtue, and then admitted to having lost $8
million gambling . on slot machines. I got to tell you, it's bad enough to
be a hypocrite with regard to gambling, but it's not just the hypocrisy that
bothers me here. It's that this man was the Chief of Staff in George H.W.
Bush's White House, and he's stupid enough to think that you can win slot
machines. I mean, that really goes beyond belief, and it makes you wonder
just what kind of decision making powers that he had while he was running
the White House.



Pat Buchanan admitted in his own book that when he was a young man he was
stopped for drunk driving and that he "kicked the policeman's ass." Dan
Burton of Indiana was one the strongest critics of Bill Clinton has admitted
that he fathered a child out of wedlock - Bill Clinton never did that -
needless to say, he also admitted an extramarital affair. And there are
several staffers from Burton's office who have complained over the years of
his behavior towards them.



Ken Calvert right here in southern California. He's the representative for
Riverside and San Clemente. He was picked up in Riverside, California for
soliciting a prostitute and claimed, despite the fact having lived in
Riverside his entire life that he had gotten lost and was asking for
directions. I've got a bridge that I'd like to sell you in Brooklyn.



Dick Cheney, the Vice President, when you talk about family values, his
daughter is a lesbian, admits it, is out about being a lesbian, and yet his
family values include opposing gay rights. His wife even refused to admit
that their daughter was a lesbian when she was admitting it. Tom DeLay of
Texas, there's at least some evidence to suggest that he was involved in a
number of little trysts. Bob Dornan out here in California who lost to
Loretta Sanchez was in his first divorce suit. Under oath, his wife said he
dragged her throughout the home by her hair and exhibited a revolver. He
was found guilty of an attack on his wife and was ordered to go to jail,
although there's not much evidence that he ever actually served time. It
could be that some of these people are simply too Republican to go to jail.
There may be something in law about that; I have a suspicion that that's the
case.



And of course Newt Gingrich, the Speaker of the House - what is there to say
about New Gingrich? He's been married three times, most recently to an
ex-staffer who is over twenty years younger than he is, and he served his
first wife who was his high school Geometry teacher with her divorce papers
while she was in the recovery room after having had a mastectomy. How's
that for family values?



Phil Gramm of Texas, family values Senator, invested $7,500 in a soft core
pornographic movie. I don't know if he made any money on it, but does it
matter? Tim Hutchinson of Arkansas, a Senator, one of the key people in the
impeachment of Bill Clinton, styled himself a conservative, family values
Republican, divorced his wife of twenty-nine years, a woman with whom he had
three sons, and now he's married a former member of his office staff again,
almost twenty years younger than he is.



I guess family values can be construed to mean you value the family that you
're with now. Henry Hyde, the man who headed up the House impeachment of
Bill Clinton, brought the charges. He had an affair with a woman, a mother
of three. She says it broke up her marriage and that he initiated the
affair and that he was single. In fact, Henry Hyde has been married all his
life or at least for the last thirty years. But presumably the values of
their family allow a little straying.



And of course Rush Limbaugh has been married three times and his family
values include a willingness to use illegal drugs at a level that is really
quite remarkable. When Newt Gingrich resigned as Speaker of the House, he
was replaced by Bob Livingston, another family values Republican. He didn't
stay in office very long though because it was revealed that he, too, had an
affair. "I have on occasion strayed in my marriage, and doing so nearly
cost me my marriage and my family. The allegation is that he had sex with
lobbyists. One wonders what he traded - votes? I don't know.



Mitch McConnell of Kentuckee; in his family, I presume that abusing people
is appropriate. His daughter is a school teacher and she has been charged
with abusing students. She punished students in a variety of ways,
including tying their hands and taping their mouths shut. I presume in this
case she learned her family values from the so-called Reverand Dobson. And
of course Laura Schlessinger, the right wing talk show host who didn't even
go to see her mother when she was dying of cancer provides another example.



But again, I want to make it clear. I take no joy in saying what I just
said. You know, everyone's family has had problems at one time or another.
None of us are perfect. My problem is when people accuse, for political
reasons, other people of engaging in behavior that's inappropriate when
ignoring their own. That ought not be the standard that we follow in this
country, although the right wing nuts do seem to follow that particular
standard.



I think family values ought to be defined a different way, especially when
you're talking about politics. Family values ought to be defined by what
you do politically that helps or hurts families. And by that measure, the
right wing nuts are far more wanting than they are even in the area of
personal morals.



Take Mr. Bush again, the President of the United States. He talks about
family values. I would argue for instance probably that the most important
family value is to value the health of children, and he's talked a great
deal about children. He gave a speech in March of 2001 at a children's
hospital, talking about how necessary it was that these institutions
operated and what a wonderful job they did. But then his first budget cut
grants to children's hospitals by 15 percent, and he additionally proposes
another 30 percent cut for children's hospitals.



It's not just a single event. He appeared in April 29, 2002 in Albuquerque,
New Mexico to talk about a program and a woman, Lucy Sallazar who was
involved in something called Head Start. It was a program for poor children
to bring them up to speed so they could function well in the schools as
young learners. He said, "Often times, citizens such as Lucy never get the
praise they deserve." He said, "Lucy, thank you for coming and representing
thousands of people like you." He stood by Lucy and he put his arm around
her, but he didn't put his arm around the program.



When it came time to offer his budget, he slashed funding for Head Start 20
percent. The program offered tutoring, it offered help to preschoolers .
and he cut it.



Some would say that probably the best thing you can do for a child, short of
making sure there are a mother and father at home, is to make sure that
child has a secure place to live. Living in a rat infested ghetto apartment
as opposed to your own house, it gives you a sense of pride of ownership.
It gives you a sense that you have a steak in America. And we have had over
the years programs designed to help poor people buy homes - not give them
homes - just help them with the logistics necessary so that instead of
paying rent, they can begin to pay a mortgage.



Here's what Bush said: "You know, today I went to the - to some of the
homes - met some of the homeowners in this newly built homes and all you've
got to do is shake their hand and listen to their stories and watch the
pride that they exhibit when they show you the kitchen and the stairs. They
showed me their home. They didn't show me somebody else's home, they showed
me their home. And they are so proud to own their own home and I want to
thank them for their hospitality, because it helps the American people
really understand what it means."



The 2004 budget, Bush phased out HOPE VI, which bought the homes for those
people that he visited. "We didn't anticipate that HOPE VI would be
eliminated." - Renee Glover, Executive Director of Atlanta Housing Authority
after finding out the 2004 budget phases out HOPE VI.



No Child Left Behind - "The administration," he said "is committed to this
effort. With the support of Congress, we will continue to work to provide
resources to schools that they need." But the 2003 budget cut No Child Left
Behind, leaving the program $7 billion short of what was authorized under
the original Bill. At the same time, he increased the amount of money to go
to voucher schools. Again, I think children have a great deal to do with
family values.



The Boys and Girls Club do a wonderful job and the President thinks so too.
He said, "I want to thank the Boys & Girls Clubs across the country . The
Boys & Girls Club have got a grand history of helping children . They're
little beacons of light for children who might not see the light."



But in his 2003 budget, he proposed eliminating all federal funding for the
Boys & Girls Clubs.



That's what I mean when I say family values. I mean supporting kids,
helping families own a home, ensuring that people have some measure of
health care. I think family values includes creating an environment in
which children can grow up without fear that environmental pollution is
going to make them sick. And yet the Bush administration has cut back on
every opportunity on the environmental rules - at every turn, they've cut
back.



The right wing, since Richard Nixon who passed some decent environmental
laws, has opposed every single environmental law ever offered before
Congress.



At the same time, it seems to me, that it's family values to have a mother
and father who are alive. And that relates to health care. This
administration has cut the funding for cancer drugs. This administration
has gone to court to prevent Americans from buying drugs in Canada. By the
way, those drugs we're buying in Canada, they're made here, shipped to
Canada, and then come back to the United States often times at 10 percent of
the cost to buy the same drug in the United States.



I know some of you out there are going to be saying, "Hey, the American drug
companies need to make a big profit so they can engage in research and
provide us with these wonderful drugs." That's true. But the truth is that
all the research together isn't as much as 30 percent of the profits that
they make. So we're not talking here about enough money. We're talking
about greed, and we're talking about a right wing political party that gets
enormous sums in campaign finance contributions from these people and
returns it by protecting them using the law.



Just to give you an example of what I'm talking about here, a breast cancer
drug Tomoxafin is $34 for 60 pills in Canada. It's $260 in the United
States. Really, what more is there to say? Just in the last two weeks, if
we look at the newspapers here in southern California, the Register and the
Times, the Times points out that Bush talks about No Child Left Behind, but
they're taking money away from the public schools and giving it to private
schools in the form of $75 million in vouchers.



If you think family values means having a job, well guess what. Under
Republican presidents from 1947 to 2001, five Republican presidents produced
and average unemployment of 6.3 percent, which is exactly what Bush had.
And the Democrats . significantly less on unemployment. Why do they have
such high unemployment under the Republicans? Well, perhaps it's because
business owners fund them, and business owners need a little higher
unemployment because it allows them to keep wages down.



At the same time, the Times talked about Republicans putting the EPA on the
endangered list. In fact, the pro-environment record of Democratic
Senators, according to the major environmental organizations, they vote with
the environment 79 percent of the time, and the average Republican Senator
votes with the environment 14 percent of the time. If the issue is jobs -
presumably, they're going to create jobs by allowing the environment to be
more polluted - then why haven't Republican Presidents produced more jobs?



Most recently, Bush has tried to pass this Clear Skies Initiative. Again,
what is this? This is another attempt to allow polluters to pollute more by
selling the right to pollute. A clean polluter can sell the right to
pollute to a dirty polluter. This isn't going to make the air better, it's
going to make the air worse! And right here in California, the Bush
administration is trying to prevent California from having stricter air and
water pollution rules then the rest of the United States.



And don't think you can get away to our pristine national parks and be safe
from the Bush administration. He's also lifted the rules on pollution from
snow mobiles and other recreational vehicles in our national parks. All in
all, the rich get richer, and the poor get poorer. And just in case anybody
thinks what I'm talking about here is "bashing the rich," and "after all,
they're the economic engine that runs the country," here's the reality -
when we talk about the richest families in the United States, Bill Gates (he
made his money the hard way) worked for it. Warran Buffet worked for it.
Paul Allen worked for it. But Alice Walton inherited, Helen Walton
inherited, Jim Walton inherited, Robert Walton inherited, Forrest Mars
inherited, Jaquelyn Mars inherited. That's the top fifteen people, and more
than half of them inherited their wealth. The argument that these people
deserve their money because they worked for it is spurious.



And this Bush tax policy that's taking from the poor and giving to the rich
is undermining families. And that's the family value I'm worried about. I
want to see those kids get better health care, I want to see the schools get
funded better, I want to see the environment get better, and I want to see
more people have jobs.
--
http://www.gentlemanjim.net/
m***@merde.com
2004-02-07 11:31:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nate
Bush
responded with a word that relates to part of a woman's anatomy that begins
with a "P."
Oh, quit being a pussy.
m***@merde.com
2004-02-07 11:37:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nate
George W. Bush himself - and again, I don't want to spend a whole lot of
time talking about this and frankly, to me, it's not very important. Except
that people need to understand how hypocritical these people are. The Bush
campaign for example, has admitted that Bush was arrested for two felonies
in his life. I wonder how many people out there themselves have been
arrested twice for felonies. Not many, I don't think.
You must REALLY hate the Kennedys. I can think of at least 10 felonies
betwixt that motley crew (Joe Sr was a bootlegger, had Mafia ties,
Teddys drunken murder of an innocent woman, JFK's murder of innocent
Cubans he helped arm and train....heck it's probably at least 20
felonies and I am not counting Skekels murder and JK Smiths rape).

BTW when Cheney got DWI's, at the time two was NOT a felony.
Nate
2004-02-07 18:32:58 UTC
Permalink
Did you not read my post? The message was not that Republicans are filthy
people. It is that they are hypocritical right wing nuts because they
accuse people on the Left of things that many of them are guilty of
themselves. Notice the subject, "HYPOCRISY" ... not "DIRTY REPUBLICANS."
--
http://www.gentlemanjim.net/
Post by m***@merde.com
Post by Nate
George W. Bush himself - and again, I don't want to spend a whole lot of
time talking about this and frankly, to me, it's not very important.
Except
Post by m***@merde.com
Post by Nate
that people need to understand how hypocritical these people are. The Bush
campaign for example, has admitted that Bush was arrested for two felonies
in his life. I wonder how many people out there themselves have been
arrested twice for felonies. Not many, I don't think.
You must REALLY hate the Kennedys. I can think of at least 10 felonies
betwixt that motley crew (Joe Sr was a bootlegger, had Mafia ties,
Teddys drunken murder of an innocent woman, JFK's murder of innocent
Cubans he helped arm and train....heck it's probably at least 20
felonies and I am not counting Skekels murder and JK Smiths rape).
BTW when Cheney got DWI's, at the time two was NOT a felony.
Roedy Green
2004-02-08 04:52:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by m***@merde.com
Teddys drunken murder of an innocent woman
"Murder?" -- he fled the scene of an accident. He was drunk driving.

If a Kennedy wanted someone murdered, they would be NOWHERE NEAR that
clumsy.


--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
Coaching, problem solving, economical contract programming.
See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jgloss.html for The Java Glossary.
Nate
2004-02-08 05:04:29 UTC
Permalink
haha ... nice.
--
Tired of the same rhetoric of lies and deceit?
Gentleman Jim fights for you!
http://www.gentlemanjim.net/
Post by Roedy Green
Post by m***@merde.com
Teddys drunken murder of an innocent woman
"Murder?" -- he fled the scene of an accident. He was drunk driving.
If a Kennedy wanted someone murdered, they would be NOWHERE NEAR that
clumsy.
--
Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
Coaching, problem solving, economical contract programming.
See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/jgloss.html for The Java Glossary.
King Pineapple
2004-02-07 12:25:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nate
Prescott Bush, for example, who was George Bush's grandfather
and a Senator, paid a large fine during World War II for continuing to do
business with Nazi Germany after American boys were over there dying
fighting the Nazis.
Really? That's not what leftist writer Joe Conanson says.




" That Democrats, along with all liberals
and moderates, got our collective asses
kicked Tuesday night is beyond dispute"
~Bryan "Zepp" Jameison
Nate
2004-02-08 19:03:33 UTC
Permalink
So you don't deny it, you just say someone else didn't say it? Hmmm. Was
he doing business with the Nazis or not? Even if he didn't pay a fine (it
was his company, not him personally), they did business with the Nazis,
right?
--
Tired of the same rhetoric of lies and deceit?
Gentleman Jim fights for you!
http://www.gentlemanjim.net/
Post by King Pineapple
Post by Nate
Prescott Bush, for example, who was George Bush's grandfather
and a Senator, paid a large fine during World War II for continuing to do
business with Nazi Germany after American boys were over there dying
fighting the Nazis.
Really? That's not what leftist writer Joe Conanson says.
" That Democrats, along with all liberals
and moderates, got our collective asses
kicked Tuesday night is beyond dispute"
~Bryan "Zepp" Jameison
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